The MOOD Podcast
In The MOOD Podcast, Matt Jacob, renowned cultural portrait photographer, dives deep into the world of photography and the visual arts, with guests from all around the creative industry, across all parts of the globe, sharing inspiring stories and experiences that will leave you wanting more. With years of experience and a passion for storytelling, Matt has become a master of capturing lesser-told human stories through his photography, and teams up with other special artists from around the world to showcase insights, experiences and opinions within the diverse and sometimes controversial photography world.
You can watch these podcasts on his Youtube channel: https://www.youtube.com/@mattyj_ay.
You can also follow Matt's work on his Instagram @mattyj_ay and his website: https://mattjacobphotography.com.
The MOOD Podcast
Living Without Boundaries; Josh Guvi, E055
In this episode of The MOOD Podcast, Josh Guvi, a world traveler and digital storyteller, shares the realities behind his social media image and the transformative power of living authentically.
Expect to Learn:
- The digital nomad lifestyle
- Earning a living through social media platforms.
- How genuine relationships and self-expression can lead to personal transformation.
- Strategies for dealing with travel a nomadic way of life.
- How to stay authentic while dealing with the demands of social media.
- The significance of storytelling, creativity and taking risks in both professional and personal life.
His narrative offers a fresh perspective on balancing authenticity with the pressures of maintaining online personas, emphasizing genuine connections over superficial engagements. Discover the raw truths and profound insights that shape Josh's journey - a testament to the power of living authentically and the profound impact of heartfelt storytelling in today's world.
Find Josh's info here:
Instagram: @joshguvi
TikTok: @joshguvi
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I booked a ticket and I just left, but to be honest, I was really depressed.
Speaker 2:You know you're traveling around the world for going on two years or over two years? Yeah, You've obviously got to pay your way. Tell us how we can do something similar. What are the kind of the tips of the trade to actually pay our way around the world?
Speaker 1:The first eight months of my traveling, I don't think I made a dollar.
Speaker 2:Do you feel like there is still a problem with those audiences who kind of look at this Instagram world or TikTok world and think that it's real?
Speaker 1:Yeah, instagram, you know, gives money now for reels. But if you start to gain a following on social media, it doesn't necessarily equal money. I had a reel that had like 7 million views or something like that. The point is I made 36 cents. What? How? Seven million?
Speaker 2:views or something like that. The point is, I made 36 cents. What? How do you edit? Usually it starts with music. How does all of this translate?
Speaker 1:into money.
Speaker 2:So I can feel people wanting me to ask this question, so we're going to ask it. Josh Goovey, welcome to the Moo Podcast. Thanks so much for coming.
Speaker 1:Thank you, man Appreciate it.
Speaker 2:Good to have you. For what are you here, a couple of weeks in Bali?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think three or four weeks until the next trip, yeah.
Speaker 2:That's probably quite a long time for you to be in one place. It seems it's amazing. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:After three weeks it feels like weird. I feel like I need to get over that, because at some point in life I need to spend more than three weeks in one place.
Speaker 2:Before we get onto your history and kind of who you are, essentially, I'm more interested to kick things off by kind of asking you know why you are who you are Like? Why would, why do people follow you? Why do people would? They click on this podcast and want to hear more about you and what you want to say.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I feel like I still ask myself that question every day to an extent. I guess what I've like reasoned in my own head which who knows like the accuracy of that is I kind of took a different route that felt unique to me and I kind of pushed out the noise of what I felt like was going to do well, or what I felt like I should put out there if I was going to put stuff out online, and I followed a totally random path that just totally felt like me and I think that resonated with a lot of people and that's a really exciting thought for me. What was that path? Hmm, I guess you know traveling and life in general, because it's like I feel like it's so much more than traveling.
Speaker 1:Traveling is just a subsect for me. It makes you feel a lot of certain ways and I really focused on trying to find a way to communicate those feelings and, like those deep, deep personal thoughts and perspectives, Try to find a way to show those without kind of throwing my own story in people's faces and more so, you know being like, hey, maybe you feel this way, Like I took this route and I had this outcome and even though that's really personal to me. Maybe other people could resonate with that, Maybe that's something that can make an impact in their lives and, funny enough, a lot of people seem to have kind of similar experiences, similar lifestyles or similar routes that work for them, and I was like, oh, like yeah, it's because I I'm not unique. You know what I mean? It's just like some of us have a hard time outputting these things. Um, so, being able to take a medium like film or social media and like show those things, it's really cool.
Speaker 2:Where? Where did it all begin? How did you go back to, kind of, how you got into content creation, filmmaking, photography, social media, travel, all that kind of stuff that I guess we're trying to label you as? But where did all that come from?
Speaker 1:Oh, that's a big story with lots of different chapters. I guess there's like a bunch of different times in my life that all the pieces came together. The first thing is when I was a kid, I loved film. I loved storytelling, school projects that was always what I was opting for. I started like becoming an editor. I did like a lot of Adobe After Effects and I worked on like Star Wars fan films. It was like my job when I was 15. Cool, very random, somehow. That led into this. That kind of sparked the film thing.
Speaker 1:But reality set in. I kind of graduated high school. Obviously I couldn't afford film school I don't think a lot of people can and I studied economics for a long time because I was really passionate about people and change and I just really fell in love with different cultures and also working on things like different communities that are kind of more in need or people living different ways than I was, and so I studied economics that brought me a lot closer to that idea and that subject. After university, I think, like a lot of economics majors I was like I don't want to do this.
Speaker 1:This is a totally boring, kind of miserable, mathematics-focused lifestyle, although it was cool. So yeah, I worked in sales for a year and, like a lot of people that work in sales for a year, doing 200 cold calls a day, I was like I don't want to do this. I was like I think I had a bit of an existential crisis. I was probably around 22 at the time and so I kind of quit my job and went traveling for six months. I think I had like $5,000 in savings, which is not enough to travel for six months. I totally bummed it, backpacked, kind of did what a kid would do at the time. It absolutely changed my life. I went completely broke by the end of it. I had nothing. I kind of had to go back to Canada, move back with my parents. I'd lost my passport. They had to pay for my flight. It was a big crash disaster at the end. But I knew after that trip I was like, okay, I don't know how I'm going to get back to this or do this in a sustainable way, but no matter what happens in life from here, because you're 22 and a lot can change I figured how do I say like I knew I had a feeling in my heart during that chapter, like I had something in my life just clicked. It was the first time I felt like in life that I felt internally like wholesomely, like really, really happy. And of course there's highs and oxytocin and you know I can just be part of that spark. But I knew there was something special about that experience and I said, even if I spend my whole life trying to chase this feeling again, I just I just want to find this again. I really hope I do, because it was unique and I had never felt like anything like that before. And so the next you know seven years, I forgot what that felt like, but I remembered that. I reminded myself to chase it again. That's all I had. I just had the knowledge that there was something that I felt that was profound enough for me to spend the rest of my life chasing it. That's kind of like the measure that I had and I think that's like a lot of things in life, you don't always remember the feeling itself as much as you remember it meant something to you. So I kind of was on a whim and a lot of things changed throughout my 20s.
Speaker 1:When I went back to Canada. I had to finish my degree. So I finished it. I was bartending for a while no-transcript, I had to go after it and I was like getting close to 30, you know, I was like 28. And I was like damn. Like you know, I feel like it'd be a weird time to backpack the world at like 35. Like I kind of want to do this sooner than later and I don't know what I'm chasing, but I just remember I felt something that like I promised myself I'd go back after it.
Speaker 1:So at one point I tore a tendon in my chest. It kind of grounded me for a bit. I was like stuck in my apartment. I did a lot of thinking. I couldn't really like work out or be active. As soon as I could, I started to like run my stairwell. This is like Canadian winter, so you can imagine just, gray, you're stuck at home. Financially, I was stressed because I couldn't really work. That's how bad my arm was. And, yeah, I had nothing to do but think about like life and what I was going to do and I was like, okay, this is really shaking things up. It might be a good time for me to make a significant change.
Speaker 1:At the time in life. I had everything I thought I wanted. I had like what I felt like was a nice car. I had an apartment that I thought was super flashy in the downtown, with a great view I thought was super flashy in the downtown, with a great view and I just was not satisfied at all, you know, and the deeper I went into it, the more empty I kind of felt.
Speaker 1:I feel like that's a similar story for a lot of people. So I was like man, like ah, and I just remember this, this knock, you know what I mean From before and like from these experiences I had in the past, and I was like was that feeling? I was 22. I was like was that feeling? I was 22. I was like was that feeling like something genuine or was this just a one-time experience? But one day I was running my stairwell I think I was on like the fourth set or something like that Really really exhausted, and I got to the top and I just had this like feeling in my chest not even my head like really my chest was just like that's it Sell everything, just forget it. Push the reset button, forget the job, forget the items you have, forget the apartment and just go, even if you don't have a plan like, just do it, because if you don't do it now, you're never going to do it. You know life's only going to get more complicated.
Speaker 1:I didn't have a partner at the time. I was single. I guess like things that kind of reset because of my injury. So I felt like this was my only chance. I didn't have enough money to go travel the world freely, so I sold everything I had. I sold the car, I got rid of the apartment. I didn't own the apartment, I was renting it. I moved in with my friend. That was about like two hours outside the city. I slept on his couch for seven months. Yes, it sucked a lot. He let me work out of his office, so I was working basically like my job job during the day, which was, like you know, roughly eight hours, and then the next four or five hours, you know, until like midnight or one in the morning.
Speaker 1:I was working on like trying to figure out ways I could make money while traveling, with a focus on creating content, which felt so aimless and so difficult and such like such a mountain that I was never going to climb.
Speaker 1:But I was like I just got to try and I just went for it. After seven months I had enough money to like feel like I could do it, so I booked a ticket and I just left and that's kind of how it started. It wasn't a smooth journey from there and I feel like the content creation kind of came I wouldn't even say in the beginning of my trip like way more down the road, after I had a lot of realizations. But that's kind of the overall story that threw me into the rush, that made me kind of jump off the cliff and take the risk to pursue something that feels impossible and looks ridiculous from the outside. You know what I mean. It looks like one of those things that, like, people actually do that for work. There's no way that, like you know what I mean, this guy must've knew someone or had this experience. But yeah, I don't know, maybe I got lucky or maybe that's just what happens when you throw yourself towards your dreams.
Speaker 2:Wow, what a story.
Speaker 1:Fantastic.
Speaker 2:Well, thanks for sharing. I mean, I feel like some of the things you said that I'm like in one of your videos, just because of the way you talk.
Speaker 1:It's so inspirational. Naturally, this is going to feel like a real. Don't worry, we'll cut it up and you can use it as well.
Speaker 2:What about kind of the? I'm intrigued as that seven months, you know what you learned and how you learned it. In order to propel, we kind of get onto your content creation and your skills in a minute because I think they're paramount. But I'm more interested in like where that came from. You know, seven months of sleeping on your friend's couch is. There's a lot of soul searching there. There's a lot of tiredness and stress and what am I doing and where exact? Give me some specifics as to where you targeted your attention into. You know how I'm going to earn this extra bit of money, or is content creating a thing that I can do?
Speaker 1:I wish I could say that during that time it was like super healthy for me. I wish I could say that. But to be honest I was. I was really depressed, like those seven months. It was a hole. I just felt like you know, when you make a really big decision and then after you're like, oh, doubt it all the time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, oh, I did just do that. But you've already committed, you know, I guess maybe that's why I made that decision, because I knew I couldn't back out of it and it would be embarrassing Do you know what I mean For me to kind of crawl back to the life that I was coming from. So I felt hopeless A lot of the times I had been doing so many late nights I wasn't really sleeping a lot. Um, I don't think it was like physically, like a super healthy time. I didn't love living on my friend's couch, uh. But I will say the thing that I think the number one thing in that time that probably helped me.
Speaker 1:I wish I could say it was internal, but I'd really say like, the guy who I decided to live with is just an amazing soul. He's my best friend, incredibly positive person. Something about being around, his energy, like kept me going. You know what I mean. Like I feel like there's a lot of things in life that I can look at and I can be like. I think, like you know, having this person made that impact for me. He kept me going, even if it wasn't that it was him encouraging me, just being around him and, uh, being in an environment that I deemed like healthy in terms of the people I was around was so refreshing from the environment I was coming from.
Speaker 1:And uh, yeah, I don't know something about that.
Speaker 1:Just like, even though everything kind of sucked and, to be honest, like I was probably crying in my car at least one night a week, like I'd leave the office he was letting me work out of his office. It would be like one or two in the morning. I like call my dad cause he was in Philippines at the time, so the time changed, and then I hang up and I would just like have a cry in my car Cause I was like this sucks, like this part of life really sucks. I really hope that like something works out, because I don't like my life right now and uh, I now and uh, I didn't love it before, but it was better than this. So, yeah, I don't know like, uh, I think just having someone, even if it's one person and even if you don't know them that well, sometimes being around people who just like have that fire in their soul as well um, no matter what it's for or people that are just positive, like it, it can save you, because we can't always lean on ourselves.
Speaker 2:I feel like as much as we want to be able to, and you feel like you carry that persona forward as well, now into you know get that kind of energy comes across in in what you put out there. Certainly don't know if that's a natural thing or you that kind of emanated from that experience part of what came out on social media for me was I'm really like two different people.
Speaker 1:I feel like I'm actually like extremely introverted person, which people always have a hard time understanding, especially like they call my group trips and like you're so much less like aggressively social than I expected because they expect me to walk into the room and be like hey, anyways, yeah, exactly, but uh, I had been like. The person you see in my videos is the person that I was with my like closest, closest friends when I was like inspired. It was a piece of me that I didn't know how to share with people, except for the people I was really close with and those people kind of encouraged me on those points and like man, you have like some incredible thoughts or like incredible ideas, and I had some friends that were kind of somewhat similar and in those personal conversations it wasn't that they told me that you should be more outward with this. I just, I guess when it was just me and the camera, I was able to access that Um and that kind of dives into another story, which is cause I lived on that boat for so long and living on a sailboat really make you feel comfortable because you're not around like the outside world at all and you get pretty lonely. Um, you were on your own I wasn't on my own, but it was a group of five people, okay and the thing is like, even though a boat is small, you get a lot of alone time because, like, everyone is 100 going to be sick of each other. Um, so you're just kind of like a lot of the time that you're living on a boat, like whether you're doing a sailing shift from like 12 am to 4 am and no one's, no one's up, or whether it's just during the day and like someone's sailing and someone's doing something else, you do spend a lot of time alone.
Speaker 1:And uh, yeah, those that kind of gave me that opportunity to like find that in myself. And then all of a sudden, I was able to like emulate that in front of a camera, which felt weird at first, and I did it and I was like there's no way anyone is gonna like this. I like this is really stupid. This is like way too me, it's like way too personal. But I was like I put it as a story, like I didn't even think I was going to post it, and then some people were like, oh, you should share this as a real blah blah blah. And I was like really Like it's just me talking on a boat saying generic things. I say really generic things. You probably notice I don't say anything, like sometimes I might say something with a bit more depth to it, but I say a lot of really generic stuff that, like I feel like it's pretty common knowledge. And that's what I felt about this. It was like you know, if you haven't tried something, you should try it. But maybe it was the way that I said it or the way that it kind of connected to me as I said it, that people connected with and yeah, I posted that. And then it was just like, oh, everything started working.
Speaker 1:That was like four months into traveling. I hadn't had like any success in anything. I was like, all right, probably not gonna do social media. At that point I wasn't even thinking about it, so I was just kind of playing with it. At that point, um, I was like, whoa, okay, I guess this whole thing, this whole journey, was about me being myself in more scenarios. It was about me just being like, you know, taking what was in here and then just being outward with that. You know, it was like a form of therapy in a way. I was like ah, I see, the second. I stopped trying to be something else the second. I stopped trying to be the cool guy that like does all the things that you see, and I just did what felt natural to me. It just it was easy. And then I was like okay, I hope everyone gets a chance to do this in life. This is not social media per se. Just, you know, I felt like that's kind of what life is about. In a way, it's a piece of it.
Speaker 2:I haven't figured out the meaning, uh, but yeah, I was like I want to share that I think, uh, what comes across for me, anyway, is the the genuine nature of what you're saying. Right, it's not. If you try and box it into something that's educational, I wouldn't say it is, but it's highly inspirational like you say you're you're giving generic knowledge, but okay, maybe it is.
Speaker 2:Maybe you're not giving like specific pieces of advice, but that's not who you are. If you're speaking from the heart, which you seem to be doing in every video, and from a storytelling perspective, because you've been that person in that story, right, that's really what I think resonates people, because they see themselves in you. Right, they see themselves oh, if he can do it, I can do it. Or if he struggled with something, I'm struggling with something I can get through it right.
Speaker 1:So if he lived on a couch and cried in his car?
Speaker 2:yeah, I can live, everyone can live on a couch and cry in their car. Do you find that that is still a problem, though? With social media it's like you know, we want to put the best versions of ourselves out there all the time, because it's curated and we want to look good, and then we don't see the audience seeing, feeling, feeling the not envy, but the kind of oh well, he's doing something amazing. Why can't? Why can't? Why is it? Why isn't it working for me and why can't I do something amazing?
Speaker 2:I feel like you've connected those worlds, but do you find that that is always a problem? Certainly for photographers and filmmakers who want to, like, put out the best production content right and make it look amazing, but you don't see often the time, that hard work, the tears, the lack of money, the tiredness and the jet lag and all the kinds of stuff that goes with it. Do you feel like there is still a problem with those audiences who who kind of look at this Instagram world or TikTok world and think that it's real, almost, yeah, yeah, absolutely okay then, do you have a?
Speaker 1:do you feel like you have a?
Speaker 2:responsibility to at least like push the push, the reality of things absolutely this world is not real.
Speaker 1:like you mean. There's realities of it, but I mean I I use instagram as a message, you know, as a platform, and even TikTok, like we spoke about. I don't agree with necessarily what these platforms. That doesn't mean that you know what I mean. I am 100% of the nature of like this is. It's such a huge gray area and I feel like a lot of people's response is being like oh well, like you know, it's really just a reflection of yourself and those things are all true. But ultimately, like I do sometimes feel like it's a platform built on making us wish that we were living a different life, and I know that because I'm living the life that I always wanted since I was a kid. It doesn't mean I figured everything out. I got lots of stuff to figure out, but like I'm just really stoked about what I've got so far. It's awesome.
Speaker 1:Sometimes I still find myself being on Instagram being like, oh, like I you know what I mean Like that natural, like I swiped through something and there's that like, oh, I'm not good enough and I'm like every day, like it's built it is, that's what it does. I don't want to do that to people. You know what I mean. That sucks and I feel like it is.
Speaker 1:It's weird that the platform I'm not saying it's the intended purpose, it's just kind of like how our minds work Like the grass is always greener. But yeah, I really I guess a big part of me wants to. You know, that's a big part of like. What I want to focus on is like trying to sometimes pull down that curtain. For a lot of people it's it's about sharing more of the negatives in their life, so like showcasing more of like the bad things and things like that. Um, for me, the route is to be honest. I think if people watch my social media, they'll see that like it feels very personal, but I don't actually share anything about my personal life on social media.
Speaker 1:Um, it's just not my, like. I said I am introverted, funny enough and, uh, I don't share that much about, like you know, the inner workings or my friendships or things like that on there. Um, but I I like to have conversations around, you know. Let's just take a step back and like look at what this thing is, that like in reality. Um, and I try and break that barrier on Instagram once in a while and like, yeah, I think that's like a part of my bigger mission is trying to talk more about that because I think it's important.
Speaker 2:I think it is. I love it. I think your stuff is incredible and I'll go into why. I think that in a minute. But I'm more interested for now is why travel? I mean, you know, I ask photographers we'll get on to photography in a minute, but a lot of the times, why photography? What is it about this medium or this form of self-expression or whatever you want to kind of define, the travel bug or the travel experience, the curiosity? Essentially, what is it about travel for you that brings out the best in you and brings out a sense of fulfillment?
Speaker 1:That's a good question. I have like a quite a deep answer to that, because I've analyzed this a lot in myself, because it's a bit of part of my you know nature. I think that, um, growing up, uh, mixed, I'm mixed, my mom's white, my dad's black, he's from Africa, my mom's from Germany. I think that, growing up in the environment that I did, I grew up in a town where I was like a very definite minority, um and I've talked about this with a lot of mixed race people, you don't really have a place to belong. You know what I mean? It's like I'm not gonna go show up in zimbabwe. People can be like hey, you're back, like yeah, they're gonna be like just picture me not.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they're like you are a foreigner, like you don't look like us, you don't talk like us, yeah, and I do feel at home in canada, but also like I never felt like you know, I feel so at home in canada and around these people, but like ultimately, especially like you're like okay, I don't look like these people. I feel somewhat different, especially and that's why I say especially mixed race people, because they don't have like, oh, it's not like they can go back somewhere and at least look like everyone and then maybe learn the language. It's like no, there's nowhere where you're really gonna kind of click in. That's not a bad thing.
Speaker 1:You become a bridge, in my opinion, um, kind of between cultures, in between you know, like different uh opinions, but it made me feel very comfortable with the idea of kind of floating, because I never felt like I belonged somewhere. Do you know what I mean? And then it became this thing of trying to find that place that I belong and then realizing that like I didn't need to, um, I didn't need that to be something that I anchored to, but it just, I guess, gives you the flexibility and encourages you to go out and explore, because it's not like there's a big group of people that naturally, are just going to be like oh, you belong here, come back to us, uh, and then in that way, like not having that super deep connection with any specific place, allows you to just be more deeply connected in moments. You know what I mean and different places.
Speaker 1:So one thing I really really value is when I'm traveling and there's a community that kind of, I feel like opens up to me or like welcomes me, and I feel like you've probably had this experience like traveling too like like wow, I just rolled up to this village and I feel like I could just stay here. Like people are incredibly open. Um, that meant a lot to me and, uh, I think that's probably what like encouraged me to keep traveling more was like being able to capture that feeling in different places and not feeling ultimately attached to any of them allowed me to just kind of keep floating and keep moving and keep experiencing that in different ways and places.
Speaker 2:Do you still feel like, though, there is a deep-seated desire to belong somewhere, or to put roots down somewhere where you feel you know permanently connected for sure?
Speaker 1:I feel like I don't have a home right now. Um, absolutely I want one. Am I going to find a place that I feel connected to? That would be great. You know what I mean. It doesn't need to be culturally.
Speaker 1:I think like a big part of my traveling and why I started was like I want to find a new home. That's how I felt when I left can. I started was like I want to find a new home. That's how I felt when I left Canada. I was like I just want to. I want to live somewhere that's not here. I felt like I was meant to live somewhere else. I don't know where that is. I guess like I figured I would travel and one day I would just like find the spot and be like here it is, I'm, I arrived but like I don't know ends up. You know what I mean. Maybe I do all this and then realize home is where I started. Yeah, I don't know. You know what I mean. Like it could be a really interesting story. It also could be really not interesting. Maybe I'm just like all right, cool, like I found a spot worth a beach and that's where I decide I don Fantastic, where does photography fit in?
Speaker 2:and video? We talked about the kind of equipment you use. Where did that? I know you have some kind of technical background with acting voiceovers, you know the editing side of things and you kind of piece that all together and at some point during your travels you thought, oh I want to document this, or I want to create something cool out of this, because your content is not just you documenting stuff, it's no it's of value, there's a message and it looks and sounds incredible. So how did you, how did that come about?
Speaker 1:well, I sucked at it for a long time, at first as we do as we do yeah and uh.
Speaker 1:Yeah. I guess, like I always, once I had set on that path of, like you know, trying to push myself into my content, I I didn't feel really connected to doing it any specific way. I was like I want to find a unique way that just feels like me. So a lot of time that I spent learning, I spent not like consuming content. I didn't watch a lot of content. I didn't watch a lot of YouTube, I didn't watch a lot of Instagram. I kind of shut everything off and just started trying random things.
Speaker 1:I guess I don't know through doing it over and over again, and I actually think, for me, like I think my natural creative space is music. My grandma's a pianist. I like I used to play piano, in no way good at it. Just putting that out there, I just feel like somewhere in my heart I was a musician and for me it's always like I just find a song that makes me feel something, like I'm always just like on Spotify or like listen to music and I find a song that makes me feel, like, feel something, and it like brings all these memories and then I just write a voiceover down and that filters into everything. It filters into the film, it filters into the editing, it filters into the shots.
Speaker 1:Even when I shoot, I always have headphones on Um. I shoot alone a lot cause I solo shoot a lot, and I always am listening to music cause I feel like that's actually the driving force and everything. And when I'm making videos, I just feel like I'm dancing to the song. Or when I'm writing a voiceover, I usually have my headphones. In same thing, I feel like I'm dancing to the song more than anything else what was the last song that made you do that?
Speaker 2:oh?
Speaker 1:that's a good question. Um, yeah, I feel like I don't like I listen to all these songs and I have them, but I don't ever like remember the names.
Speaker 2:There's like a song that, like like a violin song I've been listening to, but I don't even know what it's called or like who the artist is do you just listen to like um random playlists or whatever spotify throws at you, or do you have set kind of like I'm going to go through this, or recommended songs?
Speaker 1:Usually it's random. Maybe I hear it on Instagram or through a radio. Usually I find a song that I like and then I kind of start the radio. I really like the soundtrack. Yeah, like you can do a radio.
Speaker 2:Yeah, spotify radio, not radio radio. People still listen to radio. I'm not 70. Yeah, no offense, people who still listen to radio. It's okay, my mom loves the radio.
Speaker 1:You can listen to the radio. You're kind of weird, but you can do it?
Speaker 2:um no, I think uh, you just choose a song and then you put the radio. Yeah, I do that all the time yeah, it just kind of throws out shit for me, though, but um, ah, there's a lot of garbage. Yeah, you gotta sit through crap, yeah.
Speaker 1:I really love the soundtrack to everything everywhere all at once, but the 824 movie. I haven't used any of those songs, but I don't know. Those songs make me feel very inspired, maybe because I connect it to the movie, which is like that's like probably my favorite movie, yeah.
Speaker 2:It's a great film. It part of what you do and you know we don't really talk about music that much, but I think it's part of it's integral to so many creators, creators, lives and inspiration, right yeah. Let's flip it, though. Who do you think that you are singing to and who do you think you are speaking to when you, when you're creating content and, more importantly, when you're posting it, you know who is that avatar, who is that audience that you are aiming your stuff at, if at all.
Speaker 1:That's the trick. I feel like I'm speaking to myself. Yeah, yeah, big misconception. Josh figured this out. He's sharing the knowledge Reality. Josh is telling himself this is what he needs to learn. You know what I mean? I really do feel like all the conversations I'm having are me telling myself that, and I guess the avatar is people who kind of have felt lost in the ways that I've felt lost and then kind of like felt found. But after learning the lesson, I kind of immediately repeated to myself to solidify what it was that's 100%. Everything that I talk about is just things that I'm it's a very, very implicit derivative of something I'm going through at the time. So if you really, like you know, kind of decoded everything, you'd be able to be like, okay, something's going on in his life to do with this subject or this subject. A hundred percent, it's me talking to myself. It's almost a journal of sorts in a weird way.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it sounds like how you started it as well was kind of almost a diary entry that popped off yeah, yeah, diary video entry.
Speaker 1:It took me a while to realize that too, and I was like, oh, like, I see what's going on yeah, people really resonate with that, that kind of stuff.
Speaker 2:And then you throw in the artistic aesthetics and you've got to, you got to win it yeah, it's fun.
Speaker 1:yeah, it's fun to combine those things and I think, like the visuals and creativity of filmmaking or photography, like, oh man, when you can connect that to an emotion to you, you know, without context it's beautiful. Then you can kind of create a context and then it's just become something even more, and I love being able to do that. Sometimes it's just as much as like the expression on someone's face.
Speaker 1:And then you tell the story, to kind of drive into that. It just feels like something you know, even if it's like an iPhone video. I like to shoot on a camera but you know it's not necessary. I don't know Like that's cool.
Speaker 2:to me it really excites me With all of these messages. What is it? Is there a common theme or common message that you're trying to portray and, if so, how do you think that evolves over time?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think it started, as you know. I think that story of me kind of like jumping off cliff's edge and taking a risk Not literally- yeah, not really Don't do that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, no, it probably started as that and now I feel like it's morphed into something else.
Speaker 1:That is a big part of my message still, but I feel like I'm past that part of my message still, but I feel like I'm past that part of my life. You know, like I'm I'm far out now, like I mean it was way, way away from taking that risk, um, so, yeah, I guess now a lot of it is trying to come back to the basics and I really focus a lot on human connection. It's like a big driver in my, uh, my reels, my work, I guess, and the storytelling that I do, um, trying to drive home messages about connecting with people. And once again, like I say, I'm talking to myself, that's because I actually don't naturally connect with people. Very often I'm very like right, solitude, work, work, work. And I have to remind myself it's always in these like small moments when I'm traveling and you know what I mean I have these like small interactions, like, oh, like I'm totally like bypassing the most important part of life. For when I go to my grandma's house and we play piano together, you know what I mean. It's like I it's only in those moments you realize you miss out on them. So human connection is probably a really big piece of what I do, and just like taking a risk in your career and your life, which is also something I talk a lot about.
Speaker 1:I think taking a risk in people and like putting your heart on the line, you know, not just in the context of uh, romantic relationships obviously that matters too but just friendships or connections like deep connections. It's really hard for us, um, it's hard for me a lot of the time to like, feel like I'm putting myself out there. Even though I do it on Instagram, it still feels different in person, which is weird, but it's a thing. Yeah, taking those risks on people I feel like is really important. I feel like that's a big part of my message at the moment and just trying to remind people that like it doesn't matter if someone's an instagrammer or filmmaker or you know, like this cool person in the limelight or someone's like some seven-year-old dude that like carves bamboo in his village.
Speaker 1:Like people are people. They're like oh, so, so, so awesome, and you tend to meet the coolest people in the weirdest places. You know what I mean, because it's it's always the people that are not trying to be an avatar that like have this incredible depth and this connection with themselves and, like you know, I'm sure you can relate that when you meet someone that is like fully, fully being themselves, it is like empowering. You're like, oh my gosh, I had a taxi driver in New Zealand, I don't know, she was like 60. And she just, I don't know like she just made me excited about life and like being around her was this like infectious energy because like she's like, she was her, she just was her totally unforgivingly like. She just like was connected with, like the flow of life.
Speaker 2:And uh yeah, you find those people in the weirdest places, yeah, wonderful, and often they're with the most simple, without sounding condescending. They often have the most simple of lives. Absolutely, you know they have, and this is why barley is, uh is so special for me is because it's full of those people that, yeah, yeah, there's people struggling, we're all struggling with things every day, but they seem to have. These people have peace, this inner peace, how they cultivate that over time, whether it's through spirituality or something more rational, but, um, I think that's, that's the essence of everything, isn't it?
Speaker 2:the human connection is, uh, I I have to remind myself that all the time when you spend 10 hours behind a laptop, hang on a minute. You know. There's one, one reason why I absolutely adore photography because it gets me a connection with another human 100, and that's the beauty of photography for me and for in a selfish no, I totally agree with you.
Speaker 1:It forces you into the environment and you know, when you've been editing for a long time and you, like, you're just like I just want to get all this stuff, you don't even.
Speaker 2:Sometimes you want to go on shoots because you're trying to like churn out all this other stuff you don't need. You don't focus on anything else and you're enjoying it.
Speaker 1:But then, like you go out and like, do so, like you do a shoot that forces you to be around people and genuinely connect with them. Otherwise it's never going to be as good if you can't create a genuine feeling and you're like oh yeah, I forgot about this. I'm so lucky that I have a job that forces me to do that, because it's easy to forget to do it.
Speaker 2:So how do you balance that, or how do you remind yourself the balance between being and becoming right it's being in the moment versus productivity, moving forward, evolving, you know, making money and working and that kind of self-development all the, all the stuff we get inundated with these days and overwhelmed with how. How do you find and I'm not saying you do it perfectly, maybe you do, maybe you don't. I feel like we all struggle with that. There is no answer, but how do you manage it's?
Speaker 1:a really good question. That is like on my mind a lot. You know what I mean. That's like one of these things that like maybe I'm not making reels about it right now because I haven't figured it out, yeah, but I'm like, okay, once you take that risk, make the jump, do the things, start doing something in life you're really excited about. You realize, you know, once you find the thing, if you're lucky enough to find the thing that you love in life, it's really hard to not do it all the time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, really hard, and then you end up resenting, not doing it all the time. Yeah, and then you become grumpy, yeah, and then you become frustrated, yeah, and then you lose perspective. The opportunity cost, you know.
Speaker 1:And then you scroll through Instagram and you're like oh this guy is getting really good, while I'm like spending time with people, I care about like it's really it can get so toxic so fast.
Speaker 1:So I don't know. I guess, like the first step is being like aware of which. I feel like most of us are super self-aware of that. I am really, really lucky in that the nature of the jobs that I've been doing recently so forcefully puts you in the moment, uh, that I don't necessarily have a choice all the time. Like I was in Madagascar a couple of weeks ago and we were doing a motorbike exhibition across Madagascar and, yeah, like I was terrified.
Speaker 1:These guys are like professional motocross racers and I'm trying to like follow them with my camera on my back and on my chest and like I didn't, like, you know, I'm just thrown to. Like you know, I don't have a choice but to be super, super present during those types of trips. And I also like host group trips that are hyper social and I don't really focus on shooting during those times. So I'm really lucky that, like I have these moments that force me into the moment outside of that, when I'm in places like this and I have my free time and I get to work as much as I want to Ooh, it's a big, it's a big problem. I work way too much, it's it's. I'm still figuring that out for sure. I have a hard time pulling myself out of it, even for one hour. It feels weird, so yeah.
Speaker 2:What do you do around that in terms of um? I don't know how do you call it Self-development? Or health practice, you know, do you have a routine, Do you? You know what do you do to at least aid in that Fitness?
Speaker 1:for sure, is like my, my route. I feel like that's just like reminiscent on. I was into fitness since I was a kid, so it's been like something that I'm really comfortable doing. So fitness and I try and just go watch the sunset, I mean that's so simple. It's so simple and it's like kind of like that's like the out of the book thing, it's like, but it actually works. That's why it's a thing, Uh. So yeah, you know, like between working out and then just kind of like watching a sunset, either with friends or on my own. I like to do stuff on my own too, I like both. Uh, but yeah, that that helps a lot.
Speaker 2:I do, we, uh, I make the mistake all the time. I'll come home around six ish, sun setting at six six 15. And we're very fortunate in our villa it kind of we look out and the sun sets behind the rice fields and it. You know, it is incredible, but I will. So many times I've caught myself looking oh yeah, that's nice, back to it, right, yeah, and it's, it's just toxic, is it? You know, what are you actually going to get done in those 10 minutes that you Not do or push somewhere else?
Speaker 1:And just be totally present, yeah.
Speaker 2:No, I've got to get this done. I've got to get this done.
Speaker 1:It's ruthless. That's why it's like I feel like you know, I had that when I had my apartment like where you have like the view and you're like sweet, now I don't have to go somewhere for sunset and you're watching at home.
Speaker 2:You're like, oh yeah, I needed to go somewhere. Take a, might never have again.
Speaker 1:So weird Cause it's like one hour out of your day and you're going to spend that scrolling anyways. You know what I mean, uh. So, yeah, that's like an internal struggle. It's amazing how, how hard that can be, but I think there's so many ways to like. I've been really into breathwork at times in my life. Um, I'm not right now. It's kind of like something I do in and out of Uh, but when I decided to go on my trip, I was doing a lot of breath work at the time. I feel like that's an amazing way to be more present, but at the same time, everyone, everyone's like looking for that one answer like oh, this is the thing you gotta do, like breath work or this, but there's a million ways.
Speaker 2:So many ways. It's just difficult now because of social media podcasts. Yeah, you know, information overload every day, right? So, oh, we need to be doing this. But I also need to be doing this, and I said this to my best mate, who's here uh, the other week, if you listened and actually took the advice of everything you saw and heard, you wouldn't have a day you'd be doing it all day, the morning, everything all day.
Speaker 1:Have you ever done like the whole, been like okay, you know what I'm gonna do in the morning routine. I'm gonna journal, I'm gonna have the coffee.
Speaker 2:At this time I'm not gonna eat like my protein at this time. Exercise, meditate journal, cold plunge sauna, whatever it is, watch the sun right.
Speaker 1:Whatever you know, before we know it it's 2 pm yeah, there's, yeah, you have nothing, and then it's like you got sunset in like you know three hours, and that's it.
Speaker 2:So you know I need to. I need to be social, so maybe I need to go out for a drink. And if you're married or you got a partner, it's like, well, I need to. I need to make sure I have quality time with them. Before you know, it's bedtime a hundred percent.
Speaker 1:so life is about sacrifices and I I believe there's chapters, there's times where you can't like if there's something that you're trying to achieve, you might not be able to have the perfect balance during that time. But I guess what's important is you need to recognize that that's a chapter and not a book and if you let that a book, you will ruin your life in the long run doing what you thought would make it amazing. So that's difficult, but also I think it's also recognizing that you know as much as social media tells us all these ways, which I think most of those ways are amazing, like that's where I probably found out about breathwork. There's a lot of ways like I guess that's what the traveling and meeting different people makes you realize, and you know, being in bali and meeting locals here, like they're not doing morning routine you know, I mean not explicitly like looking at, like that they're not doing cold plunges and things like that they're finding more natural ways or ways that are like familiar in their environments to be present.
Speaker 1:And that's the thing. You don't have to find a specific way to do it, you could just. It just matters like my grandma she plays piano or she goes to church. I, I don't know, like, do you know what I mean? There's a million different ways and like there's the cool ways and like the modern way, but it doesn't mean everyone has to do it that way. You could do something really silly, 100%, but as long as, like, you were really present in that time and ideally you're not looking at a screen, but maybe you are, I don't know.
Speaker 2:But like I, reading books for thousands of years. Yeah, you know my wife's great with that she'll sit in the corner of a room and just read a book. Yeah, let's just do that, even if it's for 15 minutes.
Speaker 1:Switch off, be present, yeah, that's.
Speaker 2:All we have is the present moment it's so difficult to balance direction forward and productivity with, oh, the only thing we have in life which is right now. It's so hard, it's so hard, it's so hard.
Speaker 1:And the curse is, if you find what you love and you love what you do, it becomes infinitely harder, yeah, yeah. Because, like then, it's not like. Oh, like you know, I remember the days where I used to work like nine to five in like an office and I'd be like five would hit, be like boom, it's gone. I didn't care, I was like it's not my business, it's not my problem anymore. From nine to five is my problem. After that it's not. And I think there's also beauty to that life. Do you know what?
Speaker 1:I mean, and that's why I'm really big on not like. I think it's really amazing to find what you love doing in life, but you don't have to.
Speaker 2:You can have an amazing life.
Speaker 1:Hey, you might even have have your routine, um, I think, like just happiness and being present, so all that really matters, uh. So yeah, if you can do that better, working nine to five hey, good for you.
Speaker 2:I got friends who are wrong with that and I think there's a lot of pressure, especially on young people these days, that they see all these online entrepreneurs and all these people that you know digital nomads and stuff, which is which is such an amazing way to to live a life for some people. It doesn't mean that everyone it's going to be right for everyone or that everyone can do it, or you know so absolutely. There's so much crap out there about you know. You don't have to be nine to five, you go and do your own things, like some people like nine to five, they'd like leaving work at work and just switching off and going to the pub at the weekends and doing what they want to do, but as long as they're able to yeah, be present in that moment, actually enjoy it for the right reasons, I think I can.
Speaker 1:It can be beautiful if you're doing it the right way. And, uh, I would say I. You know, I spend a lot of time in bali. I meet a lot of different people. I meet a lot of people that are like in their thing, they're in their flow and they're super happy. I also meet a lot of people that are like in their thing, they're in their flow and they're super happy. I also meet a lot of people that are just like you know. Maybe they're happy but like I guess the message is like, just being in Bali doesn't make your life immediately better. I have a friend who's an accountant. One of my best friends is an accountant, that is, I am just, you know, no offense to accounts, but that might be the world's most boring job. I know this because him and I talk about tax a lot. He's become incredibly useful now, you know, like five years ago. They're extremely useful, but fucking boring.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Five years ago, like you know, we all made fun of his job. Now it's like you know, he's like the guy you call all the time. He is the happiest guy, One of the happiest people I know, and I would say that he's considerably happier than a lot of people I meet in Bali. I, I meet in Bali. I also meet a lot of happy people in Bali, but like it's just like it didn't matter. Do you know what I mean? He just set his priorities. He never work was never his full thing. He just he actually like always focused on relationships and doing things and like going out and spending time with friends and family, and it made a huge difference in his life. Like the guy is genuinely really happy. So it doesn't really matter what you end up doing. Absolutely, I tell people go chase your dreams, because I love it. That works for me. But I also want to make sure I'm not telling people this is the only way to be happy.
Speaker 2:It's not Well, your dream could be that life. My father-in-law was exactly the same accountant for 40, 50 years, lived in the same town for 40, 50 years. Joined the same sports clubs everyone in the everyone knows, and he's the happiest guy. He loves it and I I'm jealous. Yeah, good, good for you it's awesome, like awesome.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's more simple than we think sometimes, and being here and meeting locals like you, it reminds you that yeah, tell us a little bit about your process and without maybe giving away trade secrets certainly when it comes to the, the making videos, making of images, how you go about doing that, both technical and more conceptual, tell us a little bit about, okay.
Speaker 1:I've got this idea.
Speaker 2:What happens then?
Speaker 1:So usually it starts with music. I find a song I really really love. It sparks an idea, even if I don't end up editing to that song. Maybe that song inspires me to think about something, or it starts with an experience. But always it's during the off time that I think about it. Like I feel like if you don't take time to actually like digest a memory, it's hard to make any reason of it. Like if you just keep going, going, going all the time, then you're not going to think too much about what it meant to you.
Speaker 1:Uh, so during those times that I'm reflecting or listening to music, I usually will have an idea. I guess an example like I made a reel about going to a boring town in Japan. I didn't really realize what it meant to me until like a couple of weeks later and I was listening to a song and I was like damn, like I think that that meant a lot to me because it was a lonely place and I didn't feel like accepted in that country. And then, like this 80 year old guy really made my day, probably made my month actually, and uh, so feeling inspired and genuinely inspired is always the start of any good story or any good photo, I feel like, uh, that's like you know that feeling inside where you know you have like something to tell. And then usually I'll write like a script, uh, based on that, not in any specific way, not using any specific app, not using any you know special like AI, just in my notes app, and it looks like crap and if you were to read it over, you'd probably be like this is a terrible script. Most of the things I say it's not about what I'm saying, it's more about how I say it. And then yeah, and then I kind of start building out what that's going to look like. So usually I try and capture, especially like the Japan thing. I was capturing it because I knew it meant something. I didn't know what it meant at the time, but I was like, okay, I want to capture this experience.
Speaker 1:In terms of the technicalities of capturing those things, I feel like it's you're thinking about a lot of things like composition and lighting, obviously, and exposure. You're thinking about a lot of things like composition and lighting, obviously, and exposure, but also, depending on what you're capturing and the story behind it, sometimes you have more or less flexibility and like what the outcome, where it's kind of meant to lay, and sometimes you're capturing images just because it looks great. Yeah, that's pretty fun too, to be honest. You know what I mean. So those usually will fill. You can use those later on for different things.
Speaker 1:But yeah, I'd say it starts with that inspiration and then you don't need a lot, but kind of having a couple specific pieces of gear with you is super, super handy, depending on how you want to capture things. So, chaz, well, for me it's my camera. I guess like I'm getting more technical. I'm like a really big, really, really big. I like only like to shoot on primes. I don't like zoom lenses. That's like I don't know. You know what I mean. That's just like one of those.
Speaker 2:Well, they know it's good.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's one of those things that you know some people be like yeah, some people like no. And yeah, I have my Sony a7S camera, just because you have a ton of versatility with light and usually you're gonna have really bad lighting and a lot of cool scenarios, um, or a lot of scenarios that mean something. So, yeah, I guess, like I'm trying to think if I'm there's so many different things that I shoot because, like some client work I shoot is like so different than what I put on my instagram, so sometimes it's hard to go about that process. But feeling inspired, listening to music is probably the mainstay for me, and if I can't listen to music at the time while I'm shooting, I have a song in my head. Being present in a place to really does make you a better shooter, in my opinion. Really hard to do. Sometimes. You know, when you're like at that rush of shooting and it's like, oh the sun's going down yeah, but if you can like take a breath and be there, hear the sounds, see the environment.
Speaker 1:When I was in nepal, this was like in the himalayas. I felt like this a lot, like I would just be like okay, like I just want to be here for a second and then I'm like whoa, this place is pretty cool and like I just noticed something about that bird or this tree that, like is not necessarily the obvious, like there's the mountain shot, you know what I mean. Um, even the sound of things, or like the hecticness of a city, interacting with people in that city. You just allowing yourself to be in the environment gives you the ability to shoot it from your perspective better. But once again, there's that balance. You know what I mean.
Speaker 1:But you know, getting there and doing that is maybe what's addicting about travel, photography and film is that you end up in some environments that force you to be present. You don't have a choice in a lot of these places. You know what I mean. It's pretty hard to roll up to some super hectic market and like be completely tuned out. So, yeah, I'd say that the process, you know it starts with the music, it starts with the inspiration, um, but when I'm kind of on location, if I'm shooting something, it also dives into being present. But a big thing about my style is so much of it is in the edit, yeah, yeah. So I feel like being inspired during that creative process is really important to you, because that's probably where most of the things I do happen is in the edit, and that's where I kind of piece all these things together and make them mean something, uh, bigger than maybe what they originally did how do you edit?
Speaker 2:tell us, tell us some little tips yeah editing.
Speaker 1:I mean, we talked off air, but your audio is is on point, thanks you gotta give us some tips on that okay, yeah, so audio weirdly not my favorite microphone to use outside of. Like I use a rode studio mic which is like not that like groundbreaking of a mic but sounds really good to me. Maybe just works really well with my voice. Um, and like a lot of my reels, like I talk into my iphone and have really I have like $500 wireless mics and they're great, but sometimes I find the iPhone audio better, which is really embarrassing to say. But like voice memo on iPhone sounds really really good, especially if you just use like a D noise and like a compressor.
Speaker 1:It just I don't know. It's great, you just kind of learn where to hold it. You also, when it's too windy, like you have to be aware of these things, but it's not. It's not that hard to get great audio. I guess you know what I mean. As long as you're willing to be holding your phone and like it's funny, because sometimes people comment on my videos be like he's not present, look he's. He's like so gripped to his phone he doesn't even want to let go of it for the shoot and I'm like no, no, that's like, that's my microphone really people yeah, everything you know there's, there's everything there is everything, yeah the trolls, yeah, and then I yeah for editing.
Speaker 1:For me I guess it depends on. For me I'm dancing to the music, um, and if there's not music, I'm dancing to the sound effects of the environment. Really big on environmental sounds, I think. For me a huge, huge inspiration with editing, sound design and sound in general and visual editing is like a24 it's like incredible sound design and it's weird sound design.
Speaker 1:It makes you really uncomfortable. I'm sure you've seen a lot of a24 movies. They really they're really uncomfortable to watch, like a lot, and they're super emotional, um, and I feel like for me, a lot of that is in the sound design, even if it's simple, even if it's odd, um, and you know, you could make your own sounds, like you just use your phone mic and you can just go about and make your own sound effects a lot of the time too, so it doesn't have to be complicated. Yeah, and I had a da vinci resolve. That's big too. I feel like this is a big for filmmakers. This is like a huge conversation it is.
Speaker 2:It is you know, and I don't really like to talk about equipment too much. Like the technical side of things too much. But you know, one thing that does come across with your videos, other than the message and how you produce them, is the post-production and the edit, and you know there's some really high quality stuff and even just things with just different stuff with creative stuff, with subtitles. You know. You know there's things that you know and how you overlay, did you?
Speaker 1:know where you put those subtitles and how they appear.
Speaker 2:Yeah, um, just just being creative with stuff like that, I think it's, it's really cool. But you also you know, coming from someone who knows think I must have spent a lot of time doing these things, but maybe not. Maybe you have done it so often now and you know exactly how to you know, what you're doing and when you want to do it. It's kind of a quick process.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it feels pretty easy now.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Like subtitles are a bit of a pain, but like yeah, I always got into like yeah, putting the words. I think that was inspired by I don't know if you ever saw Secret Life of Walter Mendy and I loved how they like put the text in it and then that, just like it just became a permanent thing for me, I was like I have to do this.
Speaker 2:Such a good film.
Speaker 1:And then because I had a lot of experience in After Effects for making lightsabers when I was 15, for some reason that translated well into like working with text. So for like more intricate stuff, I just got really fast at it, so like adding text reflections in the water and stuff. Like it's actually not hard if you know the program, um. So I just got really fast at doing things like that, so it just never felt like a huge chore for me to add to it. And I think because I like the process of post-production because I came from like really liking vfx when I was young and like really liking editing that, like I don't mind experimenting a bit, yeah, and I get carried away. I mean, if I'm opening after effects I might be gone for like nine hours on like four seconds, but for some reason like that's another form of art to me.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh, it definitely is yeah.
Speaker 1:Um so, like I enjoy, I enjoy that process, but generally it's pretty fast for the most part, for most of the stuff I do.
Speaker 2:How does all this and I can feel people wanting me to ask this question, so I'm going to ask it but how does all of this translate into money? You know you're traveling around the world for going on two years or over two years, or yeah, um, you know you've obviously got to pay your way. I'm sure a lot of that came from obviously working multiple jobs, seven months and savings, but tell us how we can do something similar and what are the kind?
Speaker 2:of the tips of the trade to actually pay our way around the world.
Speaker 1:That is the golden question. I think I get like probably eight DMs a day of people like what's the income?
Speaker 2:Like how do I do?
Speaker 1:it and that is okay, I guess, for me. I was lucky because I had an entrepreneurial background, because I had a business in Vancouver. So being used to the idea of like kind of using your own means to make money, makes you more aware of opportunities in your environment to make money. The first eight months of my traveling I don't think I made a dollar from social media. I didn't start doing stuff on social media until four months in. But, like, those first eight months were all in savings. It takes a lot of savings to travel for eight months but, mind you, I was living on a boat for four of those months which was free.
Speaker 1:I got really lucky and a boat reached out to me and said if you help us with our YouTube channel, we'll let you live on the boat for free, kind of thing.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:It's like a work exchange, so that was like a huge. So I probably paid for about four months of traveling. My first way of making money outside of that, like once I started, was group trips. I had two big opportunities and then, like I started branching out a lot of things at the same time. So the first thing I thought of doing is like okay, I have a following. Now, just because you have a following doesn't mean you make money.
Speaker 1:I know people with a lot of followers that make very little money and people with very little followers that make a lot of money on social media. It just depends on your perspective. So I looked for ways to make money with my platform that didn't feel like I was selling out, cause I did not want to like roll up and be like hey, like, buy this hair gel. You know what I mean Like things that didn't make sense. So I started hosting group trips and that was a way that I was able to make some money and keep doing what I was doing. I made pretty decent money from that, I'd say, but it was a lot of effort and I didn't use external, like third party, platforms. I just planned my own group trip and we did it, which is easier than I thought it was going to be to do. Like, you kind of reach out to hostels and they're like yeah, like sure, we can set this up for you. So you don't really end up designing the trip like a hostel, does it for you. So you don't even really end up designing the trip Like a hostel does it for you. Outside of that, I, uh, because of the awareness people had of me, I was totally able to use that as kind of a flex of clients.
Speaker 1:So one of the biggest things was I was in Fiji. I didn't have service. I was on the boat and we had just done like an 11 day crossing from New Zealand to Fiji. It's supposed to take four days. We hit a storm and we had no service during the whole time. When I got to Fiji, my friend reached out to me and he's like hey, like this motorcycle expedition company was looking for a videographer and I know that you love riding dirt bikes. So I just told them that you'd be down to do it and I guess, because they saw my social media, they use that. It just makes you more human. Do you know what? I a lot easier if you can watch like 20 videos of them talking and be like okay, you know he's a person, he has a camera.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he seems to know what he's doing. Uh, so even if it's just recognition, like brand recognition, in the beginning, that helps so so much. Um, so, yeah, they, they chose me and I went and I rode across mongolia immediately after the boat trip and that was absurd but really fun and really cool, and I still work with those guys. So in the beginning sometimes it's things like that, you know, I mean, I think that you have to like it's not going to be, like there's one answer, like you can, oh, sell digital products to do this, you can do all these different things, but you kind of have to look at your brand and say, like what can I offer that's actually a value to the people that follow me?
Speaker 1:like don't offer things that aren't valuable hey I've done the odd real like here, like advertising, something where I'm like, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:But like icky.
Speaker 1:Yes, 100 and I feel like nobody really wants to like have a whole page of doing that and that's not a good long-term strategy. Um, so just figure out, like what do you have a value that you could offer your audience, and sometimes that's not obvious. Um, and maybe like talk to a mentor or talk to someone external to your brand that can look at your brand from the outside. But if you start to gain a following on social media, it doesn't necessarily equal money. And for people that say like, oh well, I want to get paid off views for, like TikTok creators fund or YouTube, I don't think that's a good strategy. Yeah, it's like the amount of money you're going to. I mean not much. Instagram, you know, gives money now for reels. I think I had a reel that had like 7 million views or something like that. What 7 million? Or maybe 5. Something like that. I actually forget, but that's not the point. The point is I made 36 cents. No way, wait, how does that work then? I don't know what the numbers are, but don't trust Instagram.
Speaker 2:It's not going to pay your wage. I'm just trying to do the maths per thousand views. You can't point zero, zero, zero, zero, one cent.
Speaker 1:No sense. So, yeah, 100%, you have to be entrepreneurial. I think if you're not entrepreneurial person in nature, then it's best to become one. If you're going to do social media, because the way to make money, and the consistent money, is being an entrepreneur. So, selling things. Especially if you're selling things to your audience rather than letting third-party brands sell things through you, because a lot are going to reach out and a lot are going to try and like, use you as, like, a spokesperson for their platform, you're going to last longer because you're actually offering things that are coming from you, so there's more value for your audience and people can see it. When it's like, sometimes people just want to support you. Like, sometimes I'll sell something, people like I'm buying this just because I like you. Yeah, like, I have no use for this. Um, and that's really cool thought that I rely on these.
Speaker 1:Yeah, your stuff probably is not very valuable like that's all the money you're getting, but like I think that, um, not being scared to sell things to like, not feeling like you're selling. If you're selling things that like you made or like if you're like digital products or if you're like selling group trips, you're not selling now, you're doing something that's like a value to people. It's like, hey, come travel with me. When I did group trips, it was crazy. We had an amazing, amazing experience and so many of the people from my group trip became creators after like they kept traveling and some of them, like they know more creators than I do now because they're like better at networking than I am. So it's, it's cool to be like, wow, we did that and we actually like gave value to people and they make connections out of it. So, yeah, it's also a better feeling when you can do things that feel like you're offering real value.
Speaker 2:Tell us a bit about your group trips. What? What do they entail?
Speaker 1:So I'm actually on my way out of group trips right now, as much as I love them. Um, I'm doing more like expeditions, like smaller expeditions, because I'm obsessed with expeditions, uh what's the difference?
Speaker 1:well, group trips is like you take like 15 to 20 people to like. We went to vietnam a couple months ago. We're going to east java in two months and these places are really cool and not like necessarily super traffic, but it's not an impossible place to go. Um, in two weeks I'm going to mongolia with eight people and with the expeditions I try and focus more on people that have I've met or been on my previous group trips or I interview people over like instagram or something like that. Um, it's way more catered. It's a lot more expensive because it's difficult like we're renting two cars and two motorbikes. Uh, it's a lot sketchier and we actually work as a team to build the plan. So like we kind of route it together as the group, as the group.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so we have like a group chat so you get them to do the work for you. Yeah, it's amazing.
Speaker 1:But yeah, it's like you kind of like you know you get to do this was inspired by some of the clients that I shoot get to do like a proper expedition with people, um, and that's like what I've fallen in love with. But my goal is like I don't necessarily that there's less money in that field. You're doing smaller trips, um, and it's way more expensive. But, uh, for me now it's a lot more of like selling digital products and things like that. Uh, rather than focusing the money just from group trips got it my group trips in the past.
Speaker 1:The larger group trips, it's like we take 15 to 20 people somewhere that I've been normally, um, somewhere that was like really meant something to me, and I try and reach out to like hostels or places I stayed in those areas and be like hey, can you help me build this trip around this place? And usually I try to go to places that are like a bit more unique, um, that like maybe some of like the third party trip platforms aren't offering, just so it feels more genuine, which is like I mean, you can go anywhere, it doesn't really matter, but yeah, those have been amazing. Um, and then expeditions is like more hardcore things, like driving across Mongolia, where surely we're probably going to get stuck and break down for three days, or something like that, which you know a lot of people don't want to sign up for.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Cool. Um, how do we find out about that? How can we? Can we get spots on those expeditions?
Speaker 1:Ooh, yeah, we can. We, yeah, get spots on those expeditions. Oh, yeah, so those expeditions I advertise on my stories. Um, I, we will build a website for it, but like so far, like mongolia, sold out in 24 hours when we put it up, because it's like a small amount of people so I realize there's a lot of demand for it.
Speaker 1:Uh, yeah, just through my stories, I guess, when they pop up and like people being around, so like people that message me often or ask me about them, that I kind of get to know over time, I'm more likely to reach out to. And if people want to come on expeditions, it's a lot easier if they don't. Sometimes people have like their profiles on private and they don't have a display photo and then like messaging me like can I like come with you to Mongolia on this expedition? You're like yes, but like yeah, who are you? I'm not saying that you know you shouldn't need to have an instagram profile, but it's helpful for me to be like you're a human being, you know, and you have a face, you know. It helps like kind of realize that.
Speaker 2:So so, yeah, tell us something as we wrap up. Yeah, um, tell us something about you that no one else might know.
Speaker 1:Oh, well, I feel like one of the things I mentioned already was like I'm an introvert, I'm very introverted, uh, I don't have a problem talking to people, but I'm not actually an extrovert. I feel like people are always shocked by that, like that's what they always mention.
Speaker 1:It'd be like oh, you're like way more quiet than I thought you were going to be and I guess I totally understand why they would assume I'm not, so it's totally fair. Um, outside of that, probably that, yeah, like my first another thing I mentioned already, but also like my first love is probably music. That, uh, I'm in no way a good musician, really want to put that out there. There's zero expectations here, but I love playing music, I love writing music, um, and I think everything that comes from my brand or like things that I create, is always stemmed from, like that core passion definitely wouldn't have known.
Speaker 2:I mean, I know there's a few videos of you playing piano in the videos, but you wouldn't have thought that music was the starting point for all of your content, which is really cool to know yeah, it's weird, I think like I grew up like I never had like a journal, I never was like good at articulating things, I would just write songs.
Speaker 1:And then like it felt like my grandma was the only person that she could like take my song and translate it into words and I was like damn, she always knew how I was feeling based on what I was playing, which was frustrating at times because it felt like so personal. Um, but a lot of me growing as a creator was like how do I use video as that channel? You know what I mean? And a big part of that was like making sure music was playing a big role in that.
Speaker 1:So that's like my first way of like outputting my, my, uh, my perspectives what does the future look like for josh?
Speaker 2:what, what's gonna, what do you hope might happen, or what are the goals for you over the next couple of years?
Speaker 1:yeah, uh, I have some crazy, crazy things happening, some really really cool opportunities, uh, but in the long run, my most probably important passion is telling, like, other people's stories, like using that same passion and energy into telling other people's stories that maybe don't get the chance to have their story told, um, rather than just like constantly telling mine.
Speaker 1:Uh, I really just fell in love, like not romantically, but like in a you know, like a more personal way, with a lot of different people from different cultures and places and personalities, um, and I just felt like some of those people like were so incredible and I was like man, like I. I just want a platform for you to just people just see who you are, cause it's important for the world to know, and it's always people that aren't interested in showcasing it or don't want to put the effort in showcasing that like they have a life worth telling the story of. Uh, so I think I'd love to get more into that in the future and that's kind of like the direction I've been going, uh, this year, so I'm really excited to start doing that more do you think there's a I?
Speaker 2:I don't struggle with this because I mean I, sometimes I, how can I put this? Um? My photography is very much based around that. It's you know, finding the subcultures that maybe some people don't know about. Yeah, you know, just because I'm curious and I'm sure there's other people who are curious, but do you think? I always think, oh, do people really? Are people really interested in this kind of stuff?
Speaker 1:or are they just?
Speaker 2:interested in in. You know tiktok dances and you know not that it matters because, we. If we're interested in it, we're going to do it we do it like we can. We can do something that we get fulfillment from, but I do always question like where's the world going with this? You know is is. Is there real like depth and interest into these types of people that we want to share with the world? I hope so I think.
Speaker 1:I think that the the really nice thing about all of the changes we've experienced over the last five years, ten years or whatever, has been that the the really nice thing about all of the changes we've experienced over the last five years, 10 years or whatever, has been that in the world where everything becomes fake, you know, or simple, or super fast, super quick, the biggest thing is, like reality seems to fade away, meaning that, like, if you look at this when tiktok first started and you look at this craze of like, I remember like big brands were doing ads with like their phone and like people talking to the phone, and I was like it's so weird that this, like you know, nike is now having a guy like talking to his phone for their ad, and I realize it's just because the more and more produced things become, the more people crave things that feel real. Um, and I guess, like for some brands, their perspective okay, we'll use the worst camera or something like that, but it's not that, it's just that I I have a deep seated belief that authenticity cannot be faked. You know, I don't know, maybe AI will get there, we'll see but currently it can't be faked. There's just something that clicks when you see content would, no matter what type of content it is. You know what I mean.
Speaker 1:Maybe you see it on tv or whatever, or the radio, for the radio people that you just hear it. You feel it in someone's voice, like it's from their heart, or you see it in their, their photos, you can feel it through their videos, like you can just feel when something's from someone's heart and I feel like that's something super super human about us that maybe we don't even understand, like how we get that intuition, but it's really cool. I feel like, as long as we keep that as a human race which I don't see going away anytime soon that things that matter will always find their voice. As long as the intent behind them and what they're you know contextually about really like is important to somebody, it will always show that that meant that much to somebody and sometimes it's way less about the content itself and it's more about like who's telling it, not necessarily about them, but like you can feel the passion yeah you know.
Speaker 1:You look at people who you know give successful speeches. It's usually not about what they're saying as much as like you're like man. I can see that this person fully, wholeheartedly, feels this way, so I know there must be something important about it. That's the message, rather than just like okay, here's the information. Information only goes so far, but when you see someone that, from the depths of their soul, believes what they're saying, it's very intriguing.
Speaker 2:I love it. Well said Thanks. Thank you so much for joining us today. It's been absolute pleasure. You know, it's such a big inspiration in how you carry yourself and that authenticity that you're talking about, so thanks please keep it up. We'll be watching the space and, um, yeah, good luck. Is there anything else you want to share with the audience? I mean, there's, there's people watching this and following you. I know, um, you know, is there anything else you want to leave them with?
Speaker 1:it's a really good question I should have thought this out like my marketing pitch, uh nothing follow me yeah, yeah, nothing I could you know think about if, if, if this stuff resonates with you, you check out my Instagram. But yeah, yeah, just that. I hope that it inspires people that feel like they need to make some kind of jump or some kind of change to maybe inch closer towards that. You know, another step in the process.
Speaker 2:Cool. Well, good for you Keep it up. It's a. It's great to have you here it's been awesome, all right Cheers. Thanks, man, thank you.
Speaker 1:Cheers.
